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  • GokūBlack10
    GokūBlack10 closed this thread because:
    Unanimous support.
    17:12, July 12, 2015

    By now, I trust that most of you have at least seen this discussion.

    Both sides raised good points and it was a good discussion. Support seemed to waver and vary, but we seem to have established that it is a good idea in theory. So, now the next step is to bring it to the entire wiki's attention and get a consensus.

    Pay close attention to this post.

    The Proposal

    What is being proposed is this:

    To change the episode names (for example: Where Does the Dream Continue?! The Search for Super Saiyan God!) to the episode serial number (for example: DBS003). So what does this mean for the names?

    • The official names will still remain in the articles and will redirect to the article, to allow people who search by name.
    • The dub-episode names (future dub names in the case of Dragon Ball Super) will also redirect to the article.

    Consistency

    Because this wiki strives to be consistent, we will follow this system with other media: namely chapter titles, movies, and OVAs. Games will not be included in this for obvious reasons. The same rules will apply to them: redirects will be made with both official and dub names.

    Note: Chapters would be named "Chapter 1 through 500~" for the original Dragon Ball manga. And "Chapter 1 (Super)", for example, for spin-off manga and side-series.

    Why do this?

    This wiki prides itself on using the most accurate, official translations available. Unfortunately, some of those translations, frankly are insane. For example, what we English speakers know as Dragon Ball Z: Bardock – The Father of Goku is officially known as Dragon Ball Z: A Lonesome, Final Battle - The Father of Z Warrior Son Goku, who Challenged Freeza.

    That's insane.

    The recent Super episodes have also been enormous. This new method will help us cut down on that.

    Furthermore it will add some convenience to the editing process. Right now, when we make an episode/movie/chapter, we usually have to move it a few times until we get the right translations. This means:

    • Constantly correcting redirects.
    • Changing potentially dozens of articles and links to match the new name.
    • And that process is repeated if we have to change the names again to correct the translation.

    All three of those bullets would be eliminated if we were to switch to this new method.

    Lastly, and perhaps more prudent, there are many readers that do not know the official name of an episode/movie/what-have you. This is fine when there is simply a dub-term they can search, but in some instances, such as many of the OVAs and all of Dragon Ball Heroes: Victory Mission, Dragon Ball Super (so far), or any of the other spin-offs, there's no dub-term for them to search.

    Disclaimer

    Now, a small disclaimer, nothing should ever be done on a wiki for the sole sake of convenience. Laziness is not an excuse, but we have more than just us to think about. Our priority is our readers. We want them to be able to navigate the wiki easily, be it by searching for episode numbers or names.

    We also want the information provided in a way that is easy to understand (while remaining factual), and sometimes, the best way to do that is to present them with information they potentially already know (an episode/movie/chapter number) and then providing them with the "meat" information in the article body.

    Vote Tally

     Support
     
     Neutral
     
     Oppose
     


    Use the following templates to vote:

     Support {{Support}}
     Neutral {{Neutral}}
     Oppose {{Oppose}}

    Please cast your votes below and, if you feel so inclined, leave a reason why. Keep in mind: This isn't a traditional vote. It is a consensus. Whatever the wiki decides is what we will go with.

    Thank you all for your time!

      Loading editor
    • There is issues with the current way of action. Just on the idea that the space in the infoboxes are limited and scarce, making it look cosmetically unusual makes me  Support — this idea. The serialization not only helps on the issue of inaccurate titles, rather it creates a practice that other episodes or chapters will have to follow to improve the wiki. 

      Rationally assuming that this will be done, with chapters, movies and episodes. My support goes torwards efforts for organization progress to reflect and make the wiki run and cosmetically look more organized, as if this pre-measure is accepted I'll play my part and do the change to make sure the work isn't just levied on Windy and Aha as a team effort. Another topic, with the "Bardock situation" is respectable.

      As much as there would be a need to be accurate with the japanese autheticity there is also a need to remember that most people who'll read this wiki are more familiar with that title. 

      Also, to raise an issue with the episode thing how will it be handled seeing that there is two anime that've come out for the series; I believe that they'll contradict themselves. Which one will be serialized with the original Dragon Ball, will it continue with Dragon Ball Kai's episodes or Dragon Ball Z's episodes?

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    • They won't:

      • DB001 - Dragon Ball
      • DBZ001 - Dragon Ball Z
      • DBK001 - Dragon Ball Kai
      • DBGT001 - Dragon Ball GT
      • DBS001 - Dragon Ball Super

      This is how we'd handle episodes.

      Edit: I  Support — this for the record.

        Loading editor
    • Excellent, then i'm completely on board. I was about to post my ideas for serializing codes. 

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    • If we're going to rename for instance Bulma and Son Goku (chapter) to Chapter 1, "Chapter 1" and other redirects like it will have to be deleted in order for the rename process to succeed.

      (From tinkering around with the Wikia Developers Wiki, and from successful testing, letting you all know that I have a script that allows me to quickly delete those redirects each with one click, and another that allows me to mass rename all of the articles, so the process will not be as vigorous as we initially presumed, if we decide to go with this suggestion)

      Carry on.

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    • You already know how I feel on this, however, since I know this stance will win out anyway, I'll give my  Support — for the sake of not being on the losing side of an argument.

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    •  Support — Ok obviously being the person who originally made this proposal I obvious support this.

      What I am trying to achieve is something that is more organized for both the viewer and editor. The viewer would be able to navigate much faster and editors wouldn't have to go through additional unnecessary steps. And I want this wikia to be better than the old one in every way possible. Anyway if this does go ahead let me know if you need any help with anything.

      And yeah, Toei loves long titles (especially when it comes to the Dragon Ball franchise) lol.

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    • Okay. So we know what to do with Dragon Ball chapters ("Chapter 1," "Chapter 50," "Chapter 200," I assume) and Dragon Ball Super chapters ["Chapter 1 (Super)", I presume], but what do we do with Dragon Ball Minus: The Departure of the Fated Child and the Jaco the Galactic Patrolman chapters? I understand that they're negative, but I see that one of the Jaco chapters (red link, doesn't have an article yet) and DB Minus share the "-1" serialization number (Maybe DB Minus could be "Chapter 0?" Funny as it sounds).

      Maybe we could fork the negative numbers and go with "Chapter 1 (Jaco)?"

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    •  I agree with this proposal as it will make editing and navigating easier. The episode titles (and movie titles) are quite long and sometimes tedious to look at. Changing the titles to the episode serial number will make everything neater, organized and proffessional, so I  Support — this new method.

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    • WindStar7125 wrote:
      Okay. So we know what to do with Dragon Ball chapters ("Chapter 1," "Chapter 50," "Chapter 200," I assume) and Dragon Ball Super chapters ["Chapter 1 (Super)", I presume], but what do we do with Dragon Ball Minus: The Departure of the Fated Child and the Jaco the Galactic Patrolman chapters? I understand that they're negative, but I see that one of the Jaco chapters (red link, doesn't have an article yet) and DB Minus share the "-1" serialization number (Maybe DB Minus could be "Chapter 0?" Funny as it sounds).

      Maybe we could fork the negative numbers and go with "Chapter 1 (Jaco)?"

      Wouldn't Dragon Ball Minus fall under One-Shots similar to Trunks the Story –A Lone Warrior–? I don't think any wiki numbers one-shots though.

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    • Okay. How about Jaco the Patrolman? They're negative numbers, in terms of Dragon Ball serial numbering. Would you rather have Chapter -11 or "Chapter 1 (Jaco)?"

      EDIT: And DBM is numbered, but not the Trunks Story.

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    • Ten Tailed Fox wrote:
      They won't:
      • DB001 - Dragon Ball
      • DBZ001 - Dragon Ball Z
      • DBK001 - Dragon Ball Kai
      • DBGT001 - Dragon Ball GT
      • DBS001 - Dragon Ball Super

      This is how we'd handle episodes.

      Edit: I  Support — this for the record.

      My opinion. Because this tidy way makes episodes shown shortly compared to this of Chapter 1, or Chapter 1 (Super). We can use:

      • Episode 1 instead of DB001 for Dragon Ball anime series.
      • Z Episode 1 instead of DBZ001 - Dragon Ball Z
      • Kai Episode 1 instead of DBK001 - Dragon Ball Kai
      • GT Episode 1 instead of DBGT001 - Dragon Ball GT
      • Super Episode 1 instead of DBS001 - Dragon Ball Super

      Otherwise, Dragon Ball Super has a manga adaption, (considered as canon while  not written by Akira??), I suggest to use Chapter 1(Super)instead of Chapter 1 (Super), just like Revival of 'F' manga. They're all spins-offs.

      Note:  Support — - I totally approve with our new brilliant method.

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    • Sulina wrote:
      Ten Tailed Fox wrote:
      They won't:
      • DB001 - Dragon Ball
      • DBZ001 - Dragon Ball Z
      • DBK001 - Dragon Ball Kai
      • DBGT001 - Dragon Ball GT
      • DBS001 - Dragon Ball Super

      This is how we'd handle episodes.

      Edit: I  Support — this for the record.

      My opinion. Because this tidy way makes episodes shown shortly compared to this of Chapter 1, or Chapter 1 (Super). We can use:
      • Episode 1 instead of DB001 for Dragon Ball anime series.
      • Z Episode 1 instead of DBZ001 - Dragon Ball Z
      • Kai Episode 1 instead of DBK001 - Dragon Ball Kai
      • GT Episode 1 instead of DBGT001 - Dragon Ball GT
      • Super Episode 1 instead of DBS001 - Dragon Ball Super

      Otherwise, Dragon Ball Super has a manga adaption, (considered as canon while  not written by Akira??), I suggest to use Chapter 1(Super)instead of Chapter 1 (Super), just like Revival of 'F' manga. They're all spins-offs.

      Note:  Support — - I totally approve with our new brilliant method.

      The problem with that is we can't call Dragon Ball episode 1 simply 'Episode 1'. We either go the way Ten-Tailed Fox proposed or 'Dragon Ball episode 1' or 'Episode 1 (Dragon Ball)'.

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    • WindStar7125 wrote: Okay. So we know what to do with Dragon Ball chapters ("Chapter 1," "Chapter 50," "Chapter 200," I assume) and Dragon Ball Super chapters ["Chapter 1 (Super)", I presume] ...

      While we try to figure out how episodes, Minus, Jaco, etc will work out, we can at least press on with the chapters of Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Super, correct?

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    • WindStar7125 wrote: Okay. How about Jaco the Patrolman? They're negative numbers, in terms of Dragon Ball serial numbering. Would you rather have Chapter -11 or "Chapter 1 (Jaco)?"

      EDIT: And DBM is numbered, but not the Trunks Story.

      The -11, -10, etc. was Toriyama's way of connecting it to Dragon Ball. That is their Dragon Ball chapter number. For instance, Jaco chapter 1 is also Dragon Ball chapter -11. So, naturally, we'd make it "Chapter -11", because that's what it is in serialization. Dragon Ball Minus, like wise, is Chapter - (minus). It's pretty much "Chapter 0", since it directly proceeds "Chapter 1" of Dragon Ball. We could use both "Chapter 0" or "Chapter -": both would be accurate.

      Edit:

      As to episode numberings, in the long run, I think the way I proposed things (DB001, etc) will work best. Bulbapeida has been using it for years. It is simple, easy to remember in a search, and easy to type, while also being extremely accurate.

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    • We could name the article "Chapter 0," and the intro could be like "Dragon Ball Minus: The Departure of the Fated Child (kanji, romaji), otherwise known as Chapter 0 or Chapter -, is the chapter that chronologically precedes Chapter 1 of the Dragon Ball manga" or so.

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    • WindStar7125 wrote: We could name the article "Chapter 0," and the intro could be like "Dragon Ball Minus: The Departure of the Fated Child (kanji, romaji), otherwise known as Chapter 0 or Chapter -, is the chapter that chronologically precedes Chapter 1 of the Dragon Ball manga" or so.

      That works.

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    • Alright. I guess I'll push on with the chapters (once I get home, lol), whilst episodes and others get figured out here.

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    •  Support — Nothing much to say. I have seen many wikis use it. It can work

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    • What will we do with Trunks the Story –A Lone Warrior– though? It's pretty much the only chapter that doesn't have really have a definitive placement (if that makes sense). We could either put it in the chapter right before chapter Future Trunks makes his debut (between chapter 329 and 330. Which kinda makes sense cause the end of the chapter takes place right before he appears in chapter 330) or go by release date (between chapters 396 and 397, which was released in the middle of the cell games).

        Loading editor
    •  Support — Nothing much to say, @NWG and @Lord Guru made an excellent explanation for why implementing this idea.

        Loading editor
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